Adding Colors and Markings to Breeds

Example of creme stallion in the Dutch warmblood studbook:
Cream on Top a buckskin stallion: http://www.horsetelex.nl/horses/pedigree/496796

http://www.hansdings.nl/images/nieuws/cream_on_top_-_stand_2.jpg
He's from the Zangersheide and that is approved as A registry at the Dutch Warmbloods studbook (KWPN)

Sorry img thingy doesn't work anymore.

Last edited on 2016-12-10 at 04:49:46 by megansparrow

Breed: Tennessee Walking Horse
Color: Brown, Seal brown etc
Marking: N/A
Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed:
Source: TWHBEA - Tennessee Walking horse Breeders' and Exhibitors' Association

Breed pdf
Scroll down to the second page of the document, and notice that, under colours, brown is very specifically mentioned, and described as black body with tan areas of muzzle, eyes, flanks and insides of legs.

Also this.

Actually registered, genetically confirmed Seal brown.

Is it disputed by a reputable source?
I don't know, I didn't see anything screaming at me It didn't exist as I was looking around for the brown colours. So, really, I see no reasonable argument It shouldn't be added, It clearly does exist.

Last edited on 2016-12-13 at 17:02:33 by RaiOkami

Being dutch I decided to triplecheck allowed colors in that breed.. I now notice megansparrow mentioned the same gen... But more examples here.

Breed: Dutch warmblood
Color: Cream gen
Marking: -
Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed: Edmundo, palomino
Hollands Golden Boy
Kentuckyboy, palomino
Modern, palomino

Is it disputed by a reputable source? It is the database of the official Royal Dutch warmblood studbook. The pages are written in Dutch, but these examples are accompanied by pictures.

Even though these are all palomino, in theory a buckskin or CrCr dutch warmblood are possible.
Then again, in the dutch warmblood, all colors are allowed, if the horse meets other criteria. This also includes sabino, and with certain purebred horses, the other parent does not matter for the foal to qualify (again, if it meets other criteria like conformation), so, in theory, you could breed Dd or Chch or even Appaloosa into the breed and have the foal registered as KWPN, the Dutch warmblood.

ah, I came here to see if someone suggested creme on the dutchies and look at that! great minds think alike.

to add to the list of evidence: this cremello dutch warmblood stallion is by another cremello dutch warmblood stallion who was "approved" and shown by registry standards, so I think it's safe to say that creme would be a good addition to the breed here on EV, though it'd be rare!

Breed: Arabian
Color: Dominant White
Marking: Varies from W20 sabino type markings to nearly white horses now sabino coloring in Arabians is usually expected to be due to some Dominant White. Here are the genes known to exist.

W20 - In homozygous form varies from Blaze and one or two stockings to a horse with star, snip and a sock or two (or sometimes more). In Homozygous form white increases to Blaze, stockings (often four) Sometimes small belly spots.

W15 - Rhocky Rhoad/Khartoon Klassic Family
Often called sabino in the past this family varies in level of white coloring from a more than W20 look to over 50% White. Most of the white in this family has crisper edges between the white and color than the other two known W mutations

W19 - Fantasia Vu Family
This family has members who look like sabinos all the way up to some pretty roany looking individuals. The whole family tends to have a roanier look than the W15 horses but many look quite similar to the W15 family horses.

W3 - R Khasper Family
These are closer to a classical dominant white. They are nearly white with color along the topline and flecking, some like R Khokopelli have a little more color on the topline (I think he is black which generally have less white than other colors)

There are also many horses with sabino type dominant white markings that do not belong to the above families but have lots of color

One Example Fenwick Orion genes unknown in his case he has huge patches of white on his sides

SS Abida - she is grey but was born white with chestnut on her topline, she now looks pure white due to her grey gene, white color genes unknown has not had a foal so do not know if she will pass this on.

Boomori Simply Stunning - Nearly completely white, had 5 nearly completely white foals but 3 had neurological problems, I do not believe this line has bred on despite some surviving white offspring.

Pictures on pinterest of the families above
https://www.pinterest.com/paulinehogdahl/white-spotting-aka-dominant-white-arabians-w3-w15-/

There are other "Sabino" Arabians unrelated to known W families that could be "sabino" due to as yet unknown DW genes. No Arabian has ever tested positive for Sabino1.

Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed: http://www.etalondx.com/dominant-white
Is it disputed by a reputable source? No

There is some thought that some of the more extreme coloring in the families is due to inheriting the family W gene along with W20. I am unsure if testing has been done on this theory.

Last edited on 2017-01-18 at 09:28:07 by Bright

I'm a bit late here, but to the best of my knowledge Clydesdales do not come in true roan. What is usually considered "roan" is just a sabino or other dominant white gene at work. I have never seen a Clyde with what appears to be true roan, nor have I heard of one with a DNA test to prove RN is actually there.

Correct, the roan marker test has never yet confirmed a roan Clyde. Nor do they have sabino, but an interstate white spotting mutation.

Breed: Quarter Horse
Color: Sooty
Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed:
http://rcquarterhorses.weebly.com/four-time-poco.html
Is it disputed by a reputable source? No I haven't found anything.

Okay, I'm slightly late in this topic, but still would love to see seal brown added to the Welsh ponies in this game. Seeing I have a seal brown filly in real life.

Breed: Welsh pony
Color: Seal brown
Marking:
Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed:
http://wpcs.uk.com/breed_information/section_a_b/ -> The WPCS in Wales states "Any colour, except piebald and skewbald" in both sections A & B as in sections C & D. Especially with the cobs you see plenty dark bays (as seal brown isn't really comonly used in the UK), but I know quite some section B's as well.
http://www.wpcs.com.au/formsinfo/pony-registrations/acceptable-colours-markings -> The Australion society gives some more information, also mentioning brown

Some ponies with this color:
Welsh cob stallion
Welsh cob stallion
Section B stallion
Section B stallion

Last edited on 2017-03-28 at 06:22:03 by Blodwyn

Breed: Arabian
Color: Grulla

proof it exists in Arabs:

http://www.equinenow.com/grullaarabian.htm

Breed: Arabian
Color: Buckskin
Markings:
proof it exists in Arabs:

http://www.arabianrun.com/arguide.htm

http://www.settingsun-stables.com/sales/

Last edited on 2017-06-20 at 16:52:58 by Midnight Outlaw

would love to see Chocolate Dun in Welshies and Gypsy Vanners

It's essentially dark bay/brown/dun with sooty.

I can only find photos of it presenting on Connemaras, but it appears in GVs and Welshies (as my cob has it) and essentially horses have very light bellies and dark sooty characteristics with dun characteristics too through dorsal stripes and leg bandings. No all chocolate duns present sooty characteristics either. It is traditionally 'lighter' than classical dark brown/dark bay horses, and even in darker, near black winter coats there are still light brown (my horse gets yellow/silver) patches on the muzzle, inside of legs/armpits and around the tail/inside of back legs. Their summer coats usually are much lighter than you'd see on a typical dark bay.

Chocolate Dun in Irish Pony

Chocolate Dun in Welsh Type Pony

Chocolate Dun in Welsh Type Pony

Chocolate Dun in my Cob

Chocolate Dun in my cob 2

Chocolate Dun in my cob 3

I'd also like to see more differentiations in grey horses, and would love to see fleabitten, dapple, rose and white greys! I'd be totally in support if fleabitten grey came from bay/chestnut/buckskin/dun horses, dapple from black/smoky black/brown horses and white grey come from cremello/palomino/perlino/moreno/dunskin/lighter coloured horses and rose grey coming from chestnuts/red dun in certain breeds. I'd also love to see horses paint markings still appear under their greying out, the way EV used too. Some white greys still have visible differences in where their markings are too.

Abbey is there not an art program that can use existing art you have and generate more colors/markings automatically of the art? just asking may be easier then using an artist.I don't know much about that sort of stuff, just throwing it out there in case someone may know of such thing lol 

I would also like to see seal brown/dark bay in Trakehners. 

it's been found in the breed several times -

one

two

three

four

I would also like to see sooty/liver chestnut introduced to trakehners.

one

two

three
four

Breed: Morgan

Color: None

Marking: Roan, Rabicano, Frame Overo, Splash

Proof it exists on purebred horses of that breed: 
Roan: http://www.morgancolors.com/rabicano.htm (has roan)
https://www.gofundme.com/RoMoPro

Roan is technically extinct in Morgans, but did exist. It only died out very recently.

Rabicano: http://www.morgancolors.com/rabicano.htm

Frame Overo: http://www.morgancolors.com/frame.htm (several have tested as having them)

Splash: http://www.morgancolors.com/splashwhite.htm
http://www.memcmorgans.com/JuniorStallions.html
http://equinetapestry.com/portfolio-items/journeys-made-to-order/ <--tested as homozygous for Splash

Is it disputed by a reputable source? Not that I know of.

Last edited on 2017-06-24 at 11:08:57 by Snaffle Bit

@Midnight Outlaw those grullos are both half arabian so the grullo comes from the non arabian parent. Also I don't believe equine now counts as proof of colors existing in a breed. Abbey wants pages that are more along the lines of breed standards pages done by breed groups. 

And as for the buckskin, your first link specifically states that arabians don't carry the cream gene needed to make buckskin. What they call buckskin is just a light bay and Abbey has stated that there wont be different shades for each color.