Are Horse Sales Dead?

I mean I do look to see what people are selling, and will buy something if I can use it in any way to further my lines, I spent at least $200,000 on horses last month that were for sale, but I never seem to see anyone even interested in the horses I have for sale myself. 

They are good showing horses too stat wise, and conformations not terrible. I just cant understand why people would pass up good horses. I end up having to early retire extra foals in the rescue so I don't acciidentally inbreed two horses that are related at some point! 

I know we can get a quite a lot of foundation horses, but still, this is rediculous! They aren't niche horses, they're racing thoroughbred!

Last edited on 2022-08-22 at 17:32:54 by нєямєѕ ѕтυ∂

I think - for the time being -, yes, it is.

This is a small community at the moment, and there are only a few dedicated breeders (if any) for given breed-discipline combos (like racing TBs). I stopped breeding for sales a long time ago because of that, so I just retire most of my extra foals early. If I have a really exceptional extra foal (with lower NSS and higher confo) I'll put it up for sale, but it's a rare occasion at the moment as I'm progressing with my large herd very slowly. On the other hand, I'm always open to give breedings from my horses if someone needs it - it hasn't been the same as years before, because the demand for outside breedings dropped as well, but it's something.

As I know the situation of horse sales, I always grab the opportunity when I can buy some extra horses (to be honest, it's rather buying up whole herds) from fellow breeders which meet my standards - that's why I feel myself to be in a downward spiral somehow, as I have much much more horses that I can care and train simultaneously on a daily basis. I know I should just stop buying at all until my herd size becomes more manageable - but I don't want a nice catch for sale to get wasted (racing TBs are really my true weakness).

But I can totally understand you. I just deal with my own herd, trying to lower its herd size [and my hunting instinct for good horses for sale] and enjoy reaching my own little milestones until the market [and showing system] works itself out.

Last edited on 2022-08-23 at 01:32:41 by Olivia

I'm not sure personally, I buy horses if I need to but I actually don't see a lot of horses for sale that I need. But then I'm also in the same boat as Olivia with trying to cut down and not buy horses. My foals sell alright for what they are, and if they don't I just use them in something later that's outside of my group. 

I think often when I turn down a sale, it's either related to something I already have or the stats are lower/wouldn't match the pair I need. Currently what I'm after is studs but I keep finding them sold or taken down a couple days later when I need them. 

I notice with yours in the past is that you don't really have them for sale for very long, especially with your foal projects. I find mine tend to sell in the 3-5 year range if they don't sell as foals. It's also just reducing the chance to sell if they're only open for 3 weeks for example, someone might not be looking for what you're selling until week 4.  Just my opinion though. 

I feel like most of the economy is non-existent, especially sales.  Most of the new players do not stick around for one reason or another, so like Olivia said, it's just a small group of active players.. with our own individual niches.  I have always felt that a lot of the aspects of this game are very individualized - you kind of just play by yourself.  We work on our own horses and our own projects, and not many people offer breeding or quality sales because they are keeping everything "in-house" and the ones they do put up for sale are because they are lesser quality and they want to get rid of them.  That definitely decreases those regularly looking for sale horses, at least that is how I see it anyway.  I myself have been on a semi-hiatus due to being bored with playing alone, to be completely honest, so I am admittedly not 100% up on what is available for sale right now like I usually am (I would typically scour through sales daily).  I guess at this point I am just checking in periodically, waiting and hoping.

Last edited on 2022-08-23 at 07:43:51 by trrrot

I guess it depends on what you are selling. I have noticed my horses with cream genes sell best followed by flaxen and silver. I sold 30+ tb foals a couple of weeks ago but still have quite a few left that have not sold yet. 

Personally, I've decided to play for myself 100%. To me, the game is half-dead so I find it pointless to try and engage with the market. When I first joined, I actively buy and sell horses but I find that too exhausting with the current state of the game. As soon as I reached my goal, I switched to private lines and focus on that. I have no plans to sell any of my private lines in the future. I also have no plans to buy any outside lines as well. I may reconsider if the admins finally take the necessary steps to improve the game. However, I am doubtful that it will ever happen.

Unfortunately I think a lot of players have come to a similar mindset as Lucia and many have become what we could call private breeders. Which, in the long run, has hurt the game more. 

I am able to sell quite a few horses but many of them have what I guess you could say would be more desirable colors in the game. I often spend real life money on credits to use items to "pretty up" my horses. I don't think it would be possible to ever make that back considering the increased EVC prices vs. what horses sell for or what people are generally willing to pay for studs. All in all I am still able to make it all work out to make the game enjoyable enough. 

I would recommend keeping horses up for sale longer than just a few weeks if they haven't sold yet. You have a better chance at someone wanting/needing what you are selling.

In addition to the private breeders, there are a lot of players who had abandoned the gameplay part of the game but stayed for the art community. Sadly, the art community is dying right now so the game appeared to be more dead than ever. It's such a shame that EV reached this point especially when we recently got new artwork for Grade Horse and Tacks. Those artworks seem to be a waste now.

I buy from outside lines specifically to introduce rarer colours into my herd. I've gone a little overboard with it, and don't really plan on doing it again. When I was buying them I wasn't paying much attention to the pedigrees, just snapping whatever I could get that had no/very few pre-existing foals with silver, pangare, flaxen, overo, etc. What I didn't notice (and am just now dealing with the repercussions of) was that a lot of the horses I bought were from lines with stallions who were bred 20+ times e.g. 1 e.g. 2

Of course, that's totally on me for buying horses that misaligned with my goals, but it's really turned me off buying from outside lines again. Avoiding inbreeding with these new horses has been and will continue to be a Big Pain. There are some breeders who only breed their horses a few times and maybe I'll buy from them in the future if they put anything up that I want. Then again, this proclamation that I will avoid buying from outside lines has only occurred because I bought a lot of horses, so until now I have been participating in horse sales. 

I don't really want to sell my horses because I don't like the idea of someone having a horse from my (admittedly extremely short) lines and overbreeding it. Again, I'd be ok with doing it with people that I know only breed horses a few times but they are few and far between given the dwindling player base.

Last edited on 2022-08-26 at 05:43:56 by Ж wox

I was gone for an unintended break for a little over 2 months, and I came back only to realize that the community has gotten even smaller (if that was even possible). I have also found the art community has even dwindled which to me is very surprising. 

To get back on topic, I must admit I have no experience in trying to sell horses at this current time and therefore cannot comment on it. I only breed once at age 20 and keep the resulting foal, I do this because I already have over 600+ horses and I try to keep bloodlines as tidy as possible. However what I have found is that the market seems to be dead, in all sense of the word. I say this because I am in need of some horses to match my unpaired horses and I have not found any that suit my breeding goals. At the time I was looking for western quarter horses, which are usually very common especially compared to my my other breeds. However after trying to find some that are under 60 NSS seems to be impossible.  

The market since I have been playing has always been flooded with high NSS, cubed horses but now I feel like they are the ONLY horses that are for sale. I believe we are in the middle of the repercussions of people choosing to keep their lines private, and never selling/studding their horses to outside players. I try to help by allowing people to message me if they want a stallion for stud, and I hope this helps in some small way, even if there are conditions attached. I also think that people are attached to their horses and bloodlines so much so that they never want other players to touch them. I must admit I am guilty of this. 

I would sell more of my horses, and I am currently thinking of selling a lot of my riding school horses however after looking at the state of the economy I think it might be better if I wait for them to die off. I also do strange discipline x breed combos such as racing Shetlands and I often wonder how much to sell them for and even question if there is a market for them. I did go though a while back (about 6 months ago), and sold a lot of my unwanted horses. But I found later on, is that a lot of those horses were then back up for sale - so I bought them all.

I think the only two solutions I can come up with, (during the middle of writing this) is to get rid of the Equine Center altogether and therefore it will force people to have to buy and stud from other players, instead of endlessly creating foundations. Another option would be to force players to be unable to breed cross-discipline and therefore limit the number of useless horses with extremely high NSS. To be honest I don't think either option will be very well received and I don't personally agree with them. However, due to the state of the economy it might be something to consider in order to tweak the game (a sacrifice for the greater good). 

I also believe that people are leaving on unrelated matters that are outside of the games control, (I won't get into it) but have you looked at the state of the world at the moment? 

Laureal, your suggestions will kill EV for good. 

Getting rid of the Equine Center means there will be no new bloodlines. Eventually, we will be forced to inbreed heavily to keep the game going. It's the worst move you can make to address the issue. We already restricted EC to 50 horses per week and it's already very difficult for us to obtain a decent horse from EC when we need a fresh line. 

Banning cross-discipline will also kill the game so fast. IMO, cross-discipline is what is keeping the game afloat so far. As I've stated in other posts, EV's community is too small (and even smaller now) to survive the cross-discipline ban. The fact that you stated that your market is flooded with high NSS horses proves it. I've been helping Olypmea with Equiverse Performance Association's registry. I had to check all horses to make sure that they aren't cubed. A lot of horses I came across in EPA have high NSS because their bloodlines had been cross-disciplined at some point. There are a lot of players that also clearly choose to ignore the NSS concept as well and make a low effort to lower the NSS. The high NSS horses flooded the market not because they are unwanted, or a mistake. They flooded the market because the majority of horses in the game have higher NSS.

It's getting very obvious that the general population does not follow the NSS concept and chooses to abandon it for various reasons so I just don't understand why EV is so determined to keep the NSS concept when the majority does not follow it.


"a sacrifice for the greater good"
I agreed with this statement. Sadly, the answer is to rehaul NSS, and more vocal players are not willing to make that sacrifice.

I think you misunderstood, I simply came up with them when I was typing, more just stating what was coming to mind. 

 "To be honest I don't think either option will be very well received and I don't personally agree with them." 

I wasn't trying to come up with any ideas, just trying to agree with the above posts and put my two cents in. In saying that, I think there needs to be more drive for people to keep playing or have new players join, may I suggest advertising the game on other websites (which will cost money). However I agree with everyone else in that something needs to be done with the economy...what I don't know. I don't agree with getting rid of the NSS system, I think you will find the majority of deluxe players and those that have been playing for years would want it to stay. 

I like Laureal's ideas. Of course I don't want to remove the Equine Centre entirely, but I think restricting the number of possible horses you could make would be a good choice in making horse sales more appealing while not entirely removing the possibility of making new lines to avoid inbreeding. I also like the NSS system. While I think outright banning people from crossbreeding would be a bit too far, I would support a little warning message popping up before the breeding happens that the foal will do really badly in shows. 

"I think you will find the majority of deluxe players and those that have been playing for years would want it to stay."

I wouldn't be too quick to assume that. There are a lot of players who are playing for years that forgo NSS systems. They are often being forgotten by more vocal players because they usually play quietly. They don't go on forums or whatever. I've seen several players from the pre-2020s era with high NSS horses. For every vocal player, I probably can easily find a quiet player that the community forgot about.


"I would support a little warning message popping up before the breeding happens that the foal will do really badly in shows."

To be honest, I doubt that will make a big difference. Most players I saw are aware of the consequence already. Most of them have high-statted horses so they are at the level where NSS barely makes any difference in shows. It was discussed on another thread where some players noticed that their horses still are winning despite having 60+ NSS once you enter the national or/and international levels. The majority of horses in that level have high NSS so the high-level shows contain mostly higher NSS horses competing against each other. In lower levels, we have low NSS competing against high NSS. That's why horses with high NSS are more likely to lose in lower levels but have a good chance of winning in higher levels. We also have riding school so many of us would use riding school instead of showing our horses. Also, we are reaching the point where riding school is better than shows. We will not earn any stats boost if the show ran with less than 5 entries. Often, I have to opt to enroll my horse in riding school instead of the show due to a lack of entries. We don't have enough active players who will show their horses constantly to ensure that all shows have 5+ entries.

Last edited on 2022-09-04 at 09:12:27 by 𝕷𝖚𝖈𝖎𝖆

i know it's not a fix-all solution (imo, neither is removing the NSS system), but i really think high confo horses should have more of a competitive chance than just being contenders at the end of grade caps or I5 shows and otherwise having to be fancy school ponies. there is not a lot of overlap between NSS breeders and confo breeders since low nss often = low confo and high confo can equal high nss. so neither wants to buy from the other since that reduces the quality of their respective stock. there's some overlap here and there and some people do try to breed for both at once, but it's fairly rare to see horses with 90+ confo and decent NSS and some of those breeders aren't active right now either. despite being established for so many years confo breeders don't get a lot of ways to profit off their work unless selling to other confo breeders or coming across a perfect opportunity in shows, neither of which is consistent. so having competitive value would encourage more people to buy from each other when they normally wouldn't. again, not something that would fix everything, but i think confo deserves a better chance in the market.

personally i'm fine with selling to confo focused players as much as nss players. if i sell a low NSS horse to someone who's only interested in their 60+ confo, i'm honestly happy that someone liked my horse enough to purchase them! i also look at high confo horses to cross with my low NSS ones for new lines and to boost my horses' confo up a bit. but a lot of people don't want their hard work being used to breed foals they wouldn't breed themselves and i think, no matter how the systems are and what game we're playing, that mentality will exist in some form and it makes it harder for ourselves. it's understandable to me even if i don't feel the same way. having multiple ways of playing this game is great, but one style of breeding having much more potential profit than the others is not.

i think a game where you can have different styles of breeding and showing and you can decide how you want to specialize is more interesting to me than everyone being a contender in shows regardless of effort, which is why i'd prefer more showing options and refinement of current NSS/confo systems than removing one or the other. i can understand people preferring differently though! i just would like the current styles of breeding to all have value instead of being discouraged.

as a side note, maybe bringing back the old EV system of raising all stats being optimal as an additional way of showing might be nice for all the cross discipline bred and cubed horses? like shows for horse total stats, given that it's a lot easier to breed a horse that way than nss and confo maybe these shows could earn a bit less money, keeping the appeal of tougher breeding focuses for people who are willing to try them. but i wasn't around at that time so if there was any major issues with that system that caused it to be removed i wouldn't know about it lol.