The Case For (Temporarily) Ignoring Stat Gain

* DISCLAIMER *  I am not saying this is how everyone should play.  Everyone should feel free to play however they want without guilt.  This is an alternative viewpoint that I feel is worth considering.

Stat gain is, for certain, one of the most popular goals in this game.  There are countless discussions on how best to achieve this.  Showing, or riding schools?  Or a mix of the two?  Sugar cubes before 3 with a discipline change?  Or keep doing it until breeding time?  Breed only on age 20 ages tomorrow, or start earlier?  There are as many strategies as there are players, but most seem to agree that we all want those sweet, sweet stats, and we're willing to spend a lot of time and even EVD to achieve them.  Even the Hall of Fame backs this up - money, points, conformation, and stats, stats, stats are what makes the game go round.

Of course, there are always those who don't care about stats at all.  Some people just want to have some really pretty horses, and don't care about all those numbers at the left of the page, or any of that competition stuff.  And stat people seem to either think that's just fine, you do you! or that it is awful for the game and clogs it up for the "serious" players.

But what if there was a way to be a "serious," competitive player, and not bother with stat gain?

(Hint - there is!)

This is what I've been doing lately.  I've got me an experimental breeding scheme going, and there's not a stat gain to be seen.

For now.

Yet my goal is still to produce the best show horses possible.

Some of you probably already see where I am going with this.  Some have considered this, and decided not to, and that's cool.  Maybe a few are quietly doing it already, and that's cool, too.  But for those who think there is no benefit to ignoring stat gain, here's some food for thought.

I would like to put forward the theory that the most effective show horse is not a high-statted horse, but one in the Novice or Local levels.  Why?  Because each grade level is only 50 stat points.  A foundation level horse generally has around 60 non-discipline stats, and most horses at those levels are foundations or at least are foundation-like.

If you can get a horse bred to the point that it has 100 total stats, with zero non-discipline stats, it will dominate the competition.  It will have a good 60-ish more points of showing power than anything it goes up against - more than an entire grade level!  Compare that to International 3 and 4, that have a spread of 1,000 stat points.  Having zero non-discipline stats is no longer such a significant boost.  In fact, it's kind of a waste, at that point.  Yet, to breed a horse down to zero non-discipline stats, it generally takes a very long time, and, by that time, those horses are going to have very high stats.

IF they actually raise those stats!

There is another way.  Keep those stats as low as possible.  Don't treat, don't train, don't show, and don't use riding schools.  Raise your horse until it is old enough to breed, pair it carefully, and work those points down one or two per generation.  It can be done, if you know the method.

It will take a lot of generations, but guess what!  Generations go by quicker when you don't have to wait until a horse is about to turn 21!  If there is no stat gain, there is no reason not to breed the moment your horse turns three!

As a fringe benefit, gameplay is easier, too.  Not nearly as much to do every day.  Just feed and breed, mostly.

Once you achieve that perfect show horse, set it loose, and watch it gallop all over the Hall of Fame!

*MORE DISCLAIMERS*  I know this method would not be everyone's cup of tea, but it is worth consideration.  At the very least, if it makes people question whether the only good horse is a high-stat horse, then I have achieved my goal.  Remember - any horse can be a good horse, if there is someone who wants it and can use it.

This is an interesting concept. One that I have also contemplated were I to get back into breeding horses. Best of luck to you and your project. I wouldn't mind seeing said herd or herds you are doing this with.

I actually love buying your horses because of what you've outlined; I'm getting great, low-level stock with better non-specialty stats than store bought. Breed more TBs! ;)

Last edited on 2019-01-20 at 15:52:53 by Sonoma

Omg I love this idea.. I spend HOURS with my horses on days Im logged in.. Its gettin ridiculous.. Not that much free time to treat, school/train/show.... every single horses in 3 stables.. ugg..
I have a couple of pre recode foundation appies and quarter horses locked because their non spec stats are single digits.. been breeding them to foundies to immediately drop non spec 2nd gen stats..and those foals are showing great!
Definitely gonna try this method, if for no other reason but to save me HOURS of work here lolz..

Last edited on 2019-01-20 at 16:35:49 by 🌀 WINDSPUN APPALOOSAS

Oh, trust me, it saves sooooooooo much time!

Once I get each breed down to 0 specs, I'll add a new discipline for that breed.  And then I'll work on raising conformation.  I want to have top level stock available for anyone, no matter what kind of horse they're into.  I might have to cycle what groups I work on each day or week or something, but it will still be quicker than waiting until the horses are almost 21 to breed.

Actually, I wonder if I could breed things down to 0 total specs.  Has anyone tried that before?  Create a universal discipline horse?  Maybe I'll try that, instead.  Though that would be hard with some of my stock that is already very low non-discipline, because they are very high-spec otherwise.  But it might be a better option than breeding down to 0 non-disciplines for each breed, in each discipline.

I'll have to play with this, and see how deep this rabbit hole goes.

Hmmmm.... Maybe I'll look into that. :) I'm currently working on Conformation though at the moment, so that's why I've been breeding a lot more lately. :)

-Feather

I like the idea, but I tought breeding down to 0 was impossible? Don't they eventually just hit an average amount of ns stats?

Thought impossible, but it isn't.  You can breed two horses with 51 non-discipline stats and get a foal with 50, if you choose it right.

I think I've got it figured out. Interesting theory and a nice project, but I think it would still take a ton of horses, multiple generations and a lot of patience to breed down to 0. Might experiment a bit on a side account.
Good luck with your project!

I think I'm going to incorporate this into my breeding program, because I'm bored but do not want to start over completely. does anyone have any advice for this? the technique is basically choosing two horses whose average has to be rounded down, right?

Start with low nss foundies, if you want to get down quickly, breed lowest with lowest. If you want to lower average nss in the entire herd, breed highest nss to lowest nss. That's what I've been doing. 

Yes, breed to the lowest available when you have something significantly lower, but if horses are within a point or two of each other, it's not that simple.  You can breed a 50 ns to a 50 ns and get a 50 ns, or you can do it and get a 49 ns.  You can even breed a 51 ns to a 50 ns and get a 49 ns.  It's all in the pairings.

It mostly has to do with odd and even numbers.  You want them mismatched.  If all three ns stats are mismatched, you can lose two points off the average.  If two ns stats are mismatched, you can lose one point.  Averages that are end in .5 are rounded down.

So you want to pick carefully, because you might actually get a lower ns total foal from a slightly higher averaged pairing, if the stats are mismatched.

Once you get down really close to zero, things get a little trickier, and I'm still ironing out the kinks in my method.  I'm getting there, though.  It seems that it may be necessary to balance the three stats to make it actually get to zero, which may actually mean increasing stats strategically in order to get something that can be lowered those last few stats.

The Foal Stat Calculator is a really useful tool when you are doing this.  Base stats are weighed much heavier in determining the foal's stats than any the parents have gained over their lives.  Chosen specialty has a role to play, too.  I recommend playing with the calculator a lot, and inputting numbers and tweaking them, just to see how they react.

Interesting, I've actually considered doing something like this on a side account or something. If you feel like doing some dressage DWBs you'd have a buyer with me ;)

Very interesting! 

Thanks Confessor!
Although I am still a bit confused. If a mare and stallion have both gained no stats in their lives, wont the goals non spec stats be an average?

Last edited on 2019-02-06 at 15:52:24 by marigold sunshine