Gathering Intel - Please Help

<sup>I actually just want to know what you all are most likely to buy from other players.  So if you could post with what breeds/disciplines you are looking for from other players. If you are more likely to buy an older foundation(15+) that has been competed, a 2nd generation foal, or a 2nd generation older horse(12+) that has been shown. 

Would you pay what used to be the average 10k/100 stats rule or do you think that is an outdated practice and only be willing to pay a portion of that? Say 5k/100 stats? 

In addition...I am wondering if people would be more likely to just use a stud/brood from another player foundation or gen 2 rather than buying them. 

Also I will say all of these theoretical horses would have 65 or less non specs and the main focus would be showing. So they may have some poors in confo, they wouldn't likely be fancy colors or there may even be some GG or Gg in there. Would those factors affect if you would buy/breed them? If so how? Would you still buy/breed but be willing to pay less or would you avoid them all together? 


Please, let me know your personal preferences, I would really and truly appreciate it!</sup> 

Last edited on 2018-09-08 at 20:57:52 by REIGNA

Quarters, chinos, gypsies. I would pick a shorter lined horse to buy or breed with since I wouldn't have to go through all the trouble of checking lines and for over breeding. A lot depends on what I would spend...color...confo..breeding ECT. I am not too picky about greys a good horse is a good horsem

Morgans, QH, Trakes- I mainly look at discipline, nns and conformation, colour is less important. The lower nss- the better. I don't care about the pedigree as long as the nss are low and discipline matches mine.  Other disciplines are fine, but only on non-converted foundies.

Last edited on 2018-09-09 at 01:30:57 by sikora

Primarily Gypsies, focused on driving. I always try to buy for stats unless it's a horse I'm hoping to convert later on and I don't know the base stats. What generation they are doesn't matter much to me at the moment. I think the 10k per 100 stat rule is outdated, because I have horses with 200+ stats that I couldn't even sell for 500 in the market, much less 20,000. If the horse has extremely low NS stats I'm willing to pay a lot more, or if the horse has a really unusual color. Not a big fan of grey. I tend to buy mainly young stock. I prefer having my own studs/mares because every time I try to use someone else's, there are either none available with the discipline I'm looking for or their owners haven't rolled over for the day or else I get a message (when using mares) that "this mare can't be bred again so soon!"

I breed foundation, paints (western), GV (driving), Trakes (Jumping) and Appy (Western)

I would rather buy foundation or second gen foundation for all my breeds as I can never find good studs or broods for what I need. 

The only one colour matters for is my GVs as they are all Crcr or CrCr

I would prefer to buy them at a low cost as I know that I wont manage to sell their better offspring for very much in this current market. 

Because of this I tend to just take horses from the RC. 

Driving Clydes, Sb+ or sbsb
Racing shetlands, gg
Racing tekes, gg
Dressage GV's, gg without tobiano, splash or overo

Short, clean pedigrees or quality foundations, no overbred ancestors, conformation over 55% and non specialty stats under 65

If a horse meets my requirements I just buy it, no matter what the price.

Last edited on 2018-09-09 at 05:35:06 by Féline

(Hoo boy, this got long. I also made it a little more general, but it should answer your questions!)

I breed a lot of different breeds and disciplines, but my process for deciding whether to purchase a horse tends to be the same for each of them.

That said, the top breeds/disciplines I purchase are driving Vanners, western Morgans, and driving minis. I will purchase for my other breeds and disciplines (show jumping Welshies, dressage Friesians, endurance Walkers, racing Tekes) but it's a lot rarer for me to shop for them specifically.

I look at a lot of factors when I purchase a horse:

First is stats. I want to see high specialty stats (the higher the better!), and low non-discipline stats (the lower the better!). 75 total non-specialty is about my cutoff, with a handful of exceptions. I'd prefer (and will pay more!) for lower. 60 and fewer is fairly good, and is about what I see in my second and third gen horses that come from post-recode foundations that were never fed non-specialty treats.) So your hypothetical below-65 non-specialty horses would be nice!

Second is color/pattern. While stats take definite priority, I also breed for a variety of color, especially in minis. I very actively avoid grey or white horses, so a horse with one of those colors would have to really impress me in some other way. I'm also not terribly likely to buy plain bay horses, though it's not a deal-breaker on a good horse. On the other hand, a horse that suits my particular color and pattern preferences (flax, dun, silver, cream, overo, brown, blanket appy, etc.) will make me less picky about other things, and will definitely be worth more money to me.

Third is pedigree, which has a few parts.
I do really like finding high quality short-lined horses (second or third gens.) So to answer your specific question above, out of the three, I'd be most interested in the second gen foal, assuming its parents were well cared for and bred relatively late in life. But I would also buy a second gen that's older, assuming its stats are decent, or a nice older foundation. So any of your hypothetical above horses would be nice.
For a lined horse, I check the first pedigree page (so back four generations) and look for any common ancestors. A repeat great-great grandparent doesn't matter much to me, though I'd prefer not to see it, and a repeat great-grandparent may still not be a deal-breaker if the horse is really good in other areas. A repeat grandparent, several repeat ancestors, or a horse showing up more than twice in the pedigree is almost certainly a no-go.
I also want to be sure that the horse isn't closely related to mine. If I'm looking to purchase a horse, it's generally because I want outside blood!
I also look for any horses in the pedigree that I consider "overbred." I know that's a bit of a controversial subject in-game, and a lot of people have different benchmarks for what they consider "overbred." I'm happiest with a horse whose parents were bred 5 or fewer times, but fewer than 10 won't give me too much of a pause, unless they're still young and might be bred further. A horse with a parent that has 25+ offspring is almost certainly a no-go. I won't check every single horse in the pedigree for number of foals, but there are a handful that I recognize by name as having sometimes 100+ offspring, and seeing that anywhere in the pedigree is an almost certain dealbreaker.

Finally, I look at conformation. This is my last priority, but not a total non-consideration. Anything 60+ adds value to a horse for me (70+ especially!), while anything 50-60 feels pretty neutral, and anything below 50 subtracts value. I'm not a confo breeder, so I'm not real picky in this realm, but I generally want my horses to be on-par or better than the average foundation.

Once all of these factors have been looked into, price doesn't matter too much to me. I'll pay well into the upper five and even six figures for a horse that meets all of these criteria well.

The 10k/100 stat rule definitely seems outdated; stats are much easier to get in the current game, without the functional stat cap the old version had. However, I personally think 5k/100 stats is low, considering the serious investment of time and effort a good horse still represents. My pricing doesn't have a real specific formula for figuring it out. I tend to price foals a bit below the 10k/100 stat mark if they're a nice color and reasonable confo, higher if they're a rare color or high confo, and knock it down if they're a plain color or low confo. When buying a horse, I am still generally willing to pay the 10k/100 stat price if everything else about the horse is good, too.

I almost never seek outside studs or broodmares, as in I cannot remember the last time I searched for one. I'll set up private breedings with players I know, but I never go looking for what's available. I pair my horses up by the time they're in their mid-teens, so I never really need an outside stud/brood. I never want to rely on an outside horse being available when I need it, and never know how many offspring a public stud might wind up with.
However, I will buy horses and save them to add into my next group of horses, so I would always rather buy a horse I like rather than breed to it.

All of the above makes me sound outrageously picky, haha, but honestly most of your hypothetical horses sound like ones I would at least consider, if they were of the breeds/disciplines that I look for. :)

I breed walkers, all disciplines. I assign my foundies their disciplines based on whatever gives them the lowest non-specs.

I know that TWHs aren't one of the more popular breeds, and I know very few dedicated breeders of them. SO many of them on the market are cubed. so when I do find one that fits my needs, I'm happy to pay pretty much anything for them. I've plunked down $100k for a single horse and would do it again in a heartbeat. it's just that I very rarely find horses that make me want to do so, y'know?

my biggest priority by far is non-spec stats. since I show in all disciplines, I'd say my average horse has around 55-58. I try not to buy above 60 unless the horse is a stat monster, and even then anything above I'd say, 75 is a no-go. single digit non-specs? I'll pay you damn near anything, haha.

color is another big one. I like my genebombs, so any combo of patterns and non-standard genes is a big selling point for me. because of this, I avoid white and grey horses for breeding stock. but an otherwise great horse that is just bay/black/chestnut is still worth it to me. I have enough patterned stock to breed something pretty from them in the next generation.

as far as pedigrees go, I feel like I'm a lot less picky than other players. as long as there isn't inbreeding on their first pedigree page, I'm good. I also don't mind "lopsided" pedigrees (i.e. a foundation horse bred to a 3rd gen) as long as yeah, there's no inbreeding. thankfully there's very few overbred walkers on the game, and most of them died a long time ago, so they generally don't show up in pedigrees much anymore. I'll avoid them if I can, but if that's the only thing knocking down an otherwise good horse then I'm okay with it.

I used to be picky about conformation but I've loosened my grip on it lately. I try to stay above 50, but if we're talking a horse with single-digit non-specs then I can settle for lower in hopes of evening it out in the next generation or two.

and finally, outside studs/broods: I'm happy to use them, but like with buying horses there's just so few that aren't cubed, so I often forget to look anymore. but like buying, if you do have a stud/brood that is what I'm looking for (and has at least some degree of restriction on how many foals it has) I'm happy to pay nearly any price.

<sup>I am asking because I realize I don't really have the desire to keep my own "lines". The part I enjoy most is showing horses. I don't want to put the effort into really keeping track of which 2nd, 3rd, 4th gens should be bred to which. It is rather unenjoyable for me. I wondered if me just showing all my foundations and then breeding 2-3 foals before they die and selling the foals would be something that would help other players to add new horses into their breeding programs. Or would this hurt the market even more? 

Thank you everyone for your responses.</sup> 

Last edited on 2018-09-12 at 14:21:13 by REIGNA

I only breed Dutch Warmbloods for showing. In other horses I mostly look for higher stats (foundation or generation horses) low non spec stats (the lower the better but nothing over 60 unless something else makes them really desirable) and a little bit of colour but it's not a deal breaker, I prefer no GG but I'd buy one if they were really good.

As for your last question I personally would be interested in some foals like that :)

To answer the most recent question, I would love to be able to purchase some high quality second gens from someone. If you're caring for and showing the parents, and breeding them a few times before they retire, their foals would definitely be of interest to me. :)

i’m always in the market for dressage and arabians, dressage thoroughbreds, and endurance mustangs. I don’t care about length of pedigree as long as they aren’t related on the first page to any of my herd (or at least to the horse I’m pairing them with). color isn’t important but it’s a nice bonus. i try not to buy horses with any poors, but if it’s great everywhere else I will!

Im always browsing the rc for gems. Ive become a bit more fussy about the foundations Im keeping nowadays. Ideally, I look for 55 or less non spec stats in whatever discipline. I'll take any breed, any discipline foundy... as long as its non spec stats are 55 or less. Im not as fussy about confo, as it can be improved through time.. Colour is always a bonus but not a big deal to me.. my main focus is non spec stats for its select discpline.
I also refuse to buy or breed to any horse thats been cubed...

I specifically breed driving Appaloosas. I have recently swerved into breeding for color/stats, but honestly, the color/coat/genes don't bother me too much if the stats and sometimes confo really stand out to me. Lines and overbreeding don't bother me. As long as the spec stats are good and the nonspec are low, I'd be more than happy to add it to my herd or breed one of mine to it. Especially since driving appies are hard to come across!